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Varnish process failure 😣
I’ve been following the Dan Lee varnishing process closely and wanted to ask for your advice.
I’m using Epifanes High Gloss one-part varnish. My schedule has been:
- First coat at 50% thinner
- Second coat at 25% thinner
- Third coat at 25% thinner
After those coats, I let the surface settle for about a week.To build up a layers from sanding the actually stain. I then scuffed with a Scotch-Brite pad and applied one coat per day for three consecutive days. After letting that set, I sand again using 220–320 grit, and then applied three more coats over three consecutive days with no sanding between those coats. I’ve repeated this cycle and am now at approximately 15 coats total.
I’m applying with a white foam roller
Despite following this process, I’m not getting anywhere near the deep gloss shown in your results, and the finish still looks flatter than expected. I wanted to ask if there’s something I may be missing, or if you have any recommendations on technique, thinning, application method, or surface prep that could explain the lack of gloss.
I’d appreciate any guidance you’re willing to share.
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Ok, it looks as though you have a good amount of build up on there which means you are getting there. At this stage I would not continue building in 3's and just focus on getting your flat final coat. Remember that as you build coat 2 and 3 on top of the other one without sanding, the finish will get progressively worse BUT you will build volume. For the final finish coat you want to sand dead flat and apply one coat only.
How does your surface look once you have sanded? At this stage you want to see a completely flat, dull white surface post sanding with no low spots. For the parts you are showing there I would do this by hand with a flat and rigid sanding block.
If possible do you have some pictures of the sanded surface that preceded this coat? If not, please share one once you have sanded this back as that will be helpful.
Sure ,
I started out with 220 hand block grit
then I vacuumed off the dust wiped with mineral spirits then repeated that process for 320 and then 400grit
I do have the 10 and 35 polar shines polish .
My question is should I wait a few months before the high grit sand and shine polish stage ? I have brush marks and orange peels still .These are practice boards but I’m think once I do the real part on the boat to book the consultation with Dan to make I’m doing it correctly .
Any and all advice is welcomed
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Ok I see the issue. You really need to sand the surface flatter before moving on to application, you should have enough product on the surface now to do this. If the surface isn't sanded flat, the low areas will just be projected through onto your final finish. Take a look through lessons 1 and 2 in module 6 of the varnishing course to see the sort of preparation that your surface should be at by this stage. You want to be aiming for 0% low spots right now.
The areas I have circled below indicate your low spots which currently represent around 10-15% I would say. Get these flat and you will see a big difference in your final coat.
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So You have said low spots and I see in the video you are talking about them but this isn’t really clear to me. Because is the shiny parts the low parts and if they are how would you sand those if they are deep?
I haven’t been doing 45 degree cross sanding as you suggest in mod 6 so I’ll try that. What happens if I go up in grit too soon or too late ?
Thank you 😊
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I’m not enrolled in the course. I did varnish work years ago, stepped away from it, and now I’m taking another run at it on this build. I’ve been studying from a few different sources, picked up a varnishing book, and have spent quite a bit of time on the phone with TotalBoat reps trying to refine my process.
Ok that makes sense. There are a couple of things I would recommend, first of all it looks like you are using a foam cored sanding block? This is really too soft for getting a true flat surface that will give you the finish you are looking for as it will forever follow the undulations of your surface. You need to be cutting down the high areas to the height of the low ones and this won't do that effectively.
I don't know what your application process is but there may likely be some improvement to be made there as I can see visible brush lines in the finish of your varnished parts. With a little refinement to the process you are using and some core fundamental learning you should be able to get a great, mirror flat finish from those parts.
My course is something that you might want to consider taking, especially if you have a whole boat to varnish after these test parts. It teaches things like sanding tool selection and building which would help you here. We also cover correct preparation of the surface and learn how that evolves throughout the process as more varnish is built on the surface. Getting these great finishes is about considering all of the variables involved.
If you can get those parts sanded back flat and a good final coat applied, I suspect the next hurdle you will cross will be dust in the finish. As surface finishes improve you start to see more of the dust that resides in it and this then becomes the next thing to tackle. We cover that as well 😀
It's very difficult for me to explain everything you need to know in a forum comment or even in a single video, hence the course which is worth considering if you want to take your finishes to the next level.
Great advice. Especially with the foam block .
I would love to buy your course it’s a tad on the expensive side for me, but I will definitely be hiring you for the 1-1 consultancy when I get to that point.
might do a few session for the planking. Then another for the varnish and deck .